Lovelife status?

[Big-Al]

LOL, thanks for your support there over_killed!

[w00p]

going out in leuven trying to make things more interesting!

[Crazy_Ivan]

My girlfriend thinks she\'s overworked at the moment... i know she actually is

[-=BYE=-RiptoR]

Well, a new girl started working at the firm I work... She\'s pretty interesting, she knew my name before I met her (damn colleagues ) and she seems to enjoy chitchatting...

I\'ll probably get sacked though

[Big-Al]

LOL

nothing wrong with talking to herand keeping it \"profesional\"

[isoFlux]

Well, there\'s this chick (drumroll....)

And we were good friends for about a year before I asked her out. She said no at first (this was over the summer), but within 2 days of arriving in the dorms (shes a floor above me), we hooked up. About two and a half weeks later it was over (she called it). I know why: mistakes I made, but she won\'t give me concrete answers:
\"I just don\'t see it working out...\"
\"Why?\"
\"I don\'t know, I just don\'t\"
\"And if I fix X, Y, and Z?\"
\"No, those aren\'t the only things\"
\"What else?\"
\"I just don\'t see it working out...\".
I smell bullshit................

Ah, well. I still have feelings for her, and we are supposed to be friends again. We are on good terms, but I rarely hang out with that cell of people (which is lame because its a large and fucking awesome group to hang out with). Though the biggest reason that has just been me being busy (my professors are running midterm and essay assembly lines...), besides it being hard to be around her.

Oh, well... Its cliche, but \"Better to have loved and lossed, than to have never loved at all.\" I\'m not quite over her, yet, but when I am, I will certainly be in the market

On a side note: within the past 2 weeks, 4 couples I know have had their shit hit the fan and either are broken up or severely damaged. Fun stuff.

I\'m done

[Big-Al]

but do feel free to continue

[dr.moe]

i heard a saying once. ive also heard a bunch of sayings many times each - a result of a lack of imagination and too television ive been thinking - but one saying comes to memory as i skim through the thread. it goes something like this, and since i cant recall \'exactly\' how it went, ill forget the quotationionios.

Past lovers that become friends fall into 1 of 2 categories = either theyre still in love or they never were.

useless information? most probably, but then, thats the story of my life. the story of my love life may come later, however.

thats all i got.

[isoFlux]

Well, I could sum it up with: \"It\'s complicated\", but If you REALLY want the gritty details: they follow. NOTE: If you don\'t find gut-spilling or bleeding hearts a fun read, or my summary above was plenty sufficient, then scroll past this post: you arent missing much

Full history of our friendship:
Part I:
We met the first day of classes our freshman year (last year), in a class called Science 2. In a nutshell it is an optional bootcamp for science majors at our uni: a 1-semester, intensive battery of often upper-division essays, projects, and reading. We hung out in a group of about 5-6 Sci 2 students and had a lot of fun within the group. She had broken up with her 4-year boyfriend from highschool over the summer because she didn\'t want to do the \"long-distance thing\". I was then in a long-distance relationship (we had known each other since junior high school, been best friends since about 2nd year of high school, and officially \"dating\" since senior year or thereabouts). Anyways, we hung out in the study group, and eventually more together. At this point it was all friendship, no thought of something more. We spent multiple intense study-sessions together (just the two of us), complete with deep conversations about ourselves, and I ended up crashing at her room a few times (no, nothing happened ). Shortly after winter break, a few weeks into 2nd semester, I made the decision to break up with my GF from highschool. It was the right, if hard, decision. She went rebound instantly and I got over her after a few months. Things progressed within the context of a normal frienship during the rest of the semester until summer.

Part II:
We both live in LA during the summer (~6hrs from our Uni, ~45 mins from each other). She got a job at a coffee shop, I had my usual one working the front desk at a hotel. In a nutshell: we spent a minumum of 1, upwards of 3 hours on the phone with each other a day. 7 days a week. I was surprised because this was quite a bit more time than we had spent together, or even talking, during school. During the last month or so of summer, it occured to me that I was starting to take an interest in her as \"more than a friend\" (what sparked that was her ex trying to get back with her, and I got jealous and kinda mad ). Well, I finally got the balls to ask her a few days later, and though we talked the following few days, she didn\'t give an answer until 2 days after I had asked (I didn\'t push the question when we were talking). She said \"no\" for a few reasons, which we discussed for about 4 hours. I shot all of them down, except for her main reason: \"I don\'t want to lose you as a friend if it doesn\'t work out.\" Yea, thats like driving 55 where the speed limit is 75 because you \"don\'t want to get in a big crash\". She conceded that it was a bullshit excuse, but didn\'t say yes. On a roadtrip with some friends to San Lous Obispo (fun shit ), she ended up on speakerphone while we were playing poker. My best friend said, in the midst of jokes and blatant (but funny) pickup lines, that we should all hang out. When we got back, it manifested into a trip to Venice Beach (about 15 mins north of where I live). She brought some of her friends, we brought some of ours, and spent the better part of a sunny friday having fun. It wasn\'t awkward, and things clicked well between us. The summer soon ended and we both made our way back up to San Jose.

Part III:
Well, we moved in on Saturday, hung out quite a bit starting Sunday. I could feel something going on, and \"things\" almost happened one night while we watched some \"Will and Grace\" episodes in my room. On Tuesday I asked her about her feelings towards me. We spent another hour or so discussing things, and I ended up spending the night there .

Part IV:
Our first week spent together was pretty much either just the two of us, or with a roomate or two. This was before classes and work, and before most of the people started branching out in the dorms. Things were great, we spent pretty much 80% of our time together (not just during the day ), hanging out in the dorms, going shopping (as we just moved in), and so forth. We communicated just as well as we did before, things really clicked: everything felt right. When classes started, we spent less time alone together and more time in bigger groups (7+ people), most of whom I didn\'t know (she knew some of them). We both got busy and ended up only spending an hour or two with eachother daily. Right about then, we lost something. A connection degraded. I couldn\'t put my finger on it then, but I can see it now. I notced it, and she did too. I was going to talk to her about it that weekend, but on Friday night, after the party moved to another room (the RAs were getting suspicious), we ended up in her room, and we had the conversation mentioned in my previous post (simplified, but those are the highlights). I came back the next day to get some closure, because I didn\'t get any answers, and had a lot to say to her. She was surprised that I came back to talk about it (which kinda angered me, because of the way things were left the following night). It ended up being a 15 minute monolog, not a conversation. In a nutshell: \"I don\'t know whether our relationship not working is mainly due to fundamental incompatabilities between us, or mistakes I (and maybe you) made. I am reluctant to break up now because it is ambiguous. I can pick out the things I did wrong, and I want to change them: not for you, but for me. If at all possible, I\'d like to give it another shot, with the appropriate modifications.\" Again, insert the other conversation. A dead-end with no answers.

Part V:
That was about... 2 weeks ago I guess. I spent the first three or so days stumbling around my apartment looking for something to do or in my bed blasting blues and wallowing in my own self-pitty. Fun stuff. After that things improved: I started feeling better, I went up to her apartment a few times, etc etc. Its been academic hell: back-to-back midterms, essays, and projects, which is why I havn\'t done a lot of partying at all (not just with her).

On why it didn\'t work:
Though I may not seem like it here: I am a fucking acid-test in large social groups I tend crack harsh, chauvanistic, often racist jokes (all in humor, if not \"good\" humor). I am overly sarcastic and blunt. This, however, is very different from what I am like in small groups (3-4 people): mild, straightforward, and down-to-earth (much like I present myself in this community). I have an idea where this developed, but thats irrelevant. I didn\'t act this way with my ex because we were rarely in such large groups. The lines I crossed when we were in large groups were easily remedied when we were alone, and I could \"make it up\" so to speak, with good behaviour. In the first week or so, that is why we did well: there were no large groups for me to be an asshole in. In the 2nd week, thats where we spend most of our time together. While not spending very much time together is no excuse for a relationship degrading, the context of the time together was the main factor: we didn\'t have enough time alone for me to show my real feelings for her; my affectionate side.

Also, partially because things moved fast with us (both emotionally and physically), I started to take the relationship for granted, and adopted the wrong kind of attitudes toward her and the relationship. It\'s hard to explain, but I sort of conceptualized our relationship the wrong way. In any case, I came off as cold and almost aloof too often. In some ways, esp during the last week, I really only looked at our physical relationship as the important or \"needing development and effort\" aspect of the relationsihp. Kind of hard to explain, but some of you may know what I\'m talking about.

That about sums up the obvious and rational reasons that I can see. There could be more: like the two of us being fundamentally incompatible (which I don\'t believe for a second), or otherwise, but I don\'t see it, and she won\'t explain it.

Projective analysis:
When she first said \"no\", during the summer, I smelled bullshit. Her reasons seemed concocted and weak (very unlike her). I read a little into it, and one night early on in our two weeks together, I asked her if those were the real reasons. My speculation was correct: her reasons were bogus. She did want to see something happen, but wanted to wait until we were hanging out in person on a consistant basis, but didn\'t want to sound like a bitch by saying \"Yes, but lets wait: I don\'t know if you\'re the same person as you are on the phone.\" I totally agree: in the same situation, I would have done someting very similar. But, the fact that she did this once brings up some intersting questions. Her weak answers to why it wouldn\'t work out could possibly suggest a similar situation: she knows whats wrong, and knows I cited the problems specifically, but still wanted to break up. This could be because she wants to see if I will really solve the problems myself (being an asshole in large groups, specifically), without the context of a \"realtionship\". This would solve two issues: I wouldn\'t have have obligations or pressure of being with her while trying to change, and if I ended up not changing we wouldn\'t go through another breakup (with the possibility of me begging for another chance... and the following downward spiral). Now, this may seem like wishful thinking, and it probably is, but the fact that she did something similar before gives it just a sliver of merit. In this situation, if I did change, and she felt things clicking again, she would give it another shot. However, if this is really the case, I\'m not sure I agree with this decision as I did before: my feelings before weren\'t hurt, and the emotional strain was very small. Now there are bigger steaks, and by doing this, she would really throw a wrench in the cogs of our friendship, whether or not she meant to. She may have underestimated my feelings for her and thought our old friendship would re-kindle immediatly. Complicated, unlikely, and silly, but a small posibilty (one which I am honestly not putting money on).

Advice collected from various people on \"friends afterward\" situations has told me a few things:
1) the friendship will never be the same
2) it will take a little longer to get over her
3) if both of us want it, our friendship will return to something resembling what it was before

She wants #3, and I do, too. However, it\'s hard being around her. I could just say \"Ah, fuck it; her friendship isn\'t worth the agony,\" and stop trying to hang out with her. But... my feelings for her won\'t let me do that: I want her to be in my life, as a friend or as a lover (preferrably both, but the former if not). Ironically, the same feelings that won\'t let me give up are the same ones that make it hard to be around her

She doesn\'t seem to be phased when I am around, unlike myself, which I know it\'s obvious that I feel awkward and so forth. This could be for a few reasons. She never had serious feelings for me to begin with; which doesn\'t sit well emotionally or logically. There was something going on that first week; it was what a healthy relationship was supposed to be like (at least all the ones I\'ve been in...), and I just don\'t like the idea of her engaging in a relationship with me when she had no feelings, or no potential for feelings for me. The first paragraph could be true: she has feelings for me, but know that they aren\'t in vain: there is potential if I fix what was wrong. Or, she could just be really quick at getting over me because she truly doesn\'t see anything happening between us because of fundamental incompatabilities. This last one is the most likely, however the least optimistic.

There isn\'t much I can do, except for try to rebuild our friendship as it was before we were \"together\". Between schoolwork and other friends (drama drama drama elsewhere :roll: ), it\'s hard to do so, but I am making time to hang out with her.

That pretty much concludes it. Questions? Al can stay afterward and clean the erasers.

On a side note: I am not changing my attitudes in large social groups for her: its for me. There are many reasons why I don\'t like how people percieve me in large groups, even if they know who I really am and what I really think about things. It is inconsistant and I don\'t communicate who I am, which is a really bad habit. Her breaking up wth me just highlighted the need for the change: it isn\'t the sole reason to change. I am changing, and people notice it, and tell me its a change for the better.

btw: http://home.arcor.de/eluine/jess.jpg <-- thats her.
http://www.geocities.com/k13pt0/jess.jpg (that should work)

[Big-Al]

\"... i don\'t have to clean the erasers do I sir?
but...

...yes sir\"

that\'s an incredible post buddy... you sound like a good laugh in large groups, lol



ps- does that link work?