Euthanasia (follow-up on \"The Terri Schiavo Thing\")

[=D.C.L.I=Everest]

Okay, since most of the stuff on the Schiavo case has been said, I found it best to start a new thread to discuss the broader subject - euthanasia. Below is the last post of the other thread.

Sgt. Boomer Wrote:I don’t doubt Terri’s parents have tried some character assassination on Michael, but he’s certainly made it easy and I don’t think they’ve stretched the truth. Whether he tried to kill her is obviously speculation, though it wouldn’t be the first time someone has gotten away with murder. At any rate I think they’ve made the point that her life shouldn’t be in his hands.

From what I’ve read, they’ll keep her heavily sedated as they starve her so she probably won’t feel any pain. But if you tried to kill a dog, or a convict, that way you’d be in jail so fast it would make your head spin.

Saying you wouldn’t want to live like that – now, while you have all your faculties – is rather irrelevant. It would be like asking someone if they wanted to go on living with fleas, sleeping on the floor, licking themselves, and eating dog food. If that someone was a person, they would say no. If that someone was a dog they’d think they had it pretty good.

As I said before, it’s impossible to know what Terri wants, and odds are pretty good she’s too brain damaged to know either. It’s also very certain that Michael’s motivations are suspect – and I’m being understated here, there’s a lot more info on him if you’re still not convinced.

The question of euthanasia in this specific case is clear-cut, and it’s outrageous that the courts have made the rulings they have. There is a huge difference between unplugging a machine that keeps body functions going after the person is clearly brain-dead and deliberately killing someone because they need some help to survive. I don’t remember the public rallying support to unplug Christopher Reeve’s ventilator. When Reeve was given the choice to die, he chose to live.

As for the question of euthanasia generally, I’m against it in principle (but I suppose I’m resigned to democratic compromise :roll: ). I also believe in the “slippery slope”, and “please kill me” could quickly turn into “please don’t kill me”, like the cards they have now in Holland (If you have time, read this article : Right to die turns into 'duty'). And it seems like it’s headed in that direction with Terri. It should not be up to a small group of people to decide what is an acceptable quality of life, and to have the power to kill you if- in their judgement- you don’t meet that standard.

I read the article that was mentioned: it\'s little news, more of an over-opinionated piece of journalism. Nothing wrong with that, of course, that\'s what I\'m good at too

Anyway, I\'ll hold my peace on this until more of you have formed an opinion.

[[JR]]

To me, its a finely drawn line, Which I have only really deeply thought about with the Terri Shiavo case.

If a person seeking euthanasia has:

(a) A brain capacity sufficient enough (undamaged by illness or injury) to be able to make such a serious judgement.

and:

(b) A serious condition, rendering them severely handicapped, leaving them in a lot of pain and putting a large strain on their lives.

Then I would say they should be able to ask for and receive euthanasia. I do not understand why, people in such conditions are made to carry on living when they are so badly effected by it that would probobly attempt suicide if they were physically able.

However, people in a mental state such as Terri\'s, is another question. I would say that all immediate family should agree that it would be the best thing, so there is no question about conspiracies.

[=D.C.L.I=Everest]

Since I\'m bored anyway, I\'ll take my chances at tackling the problem right now. Well, just a preview of my thoughts, anyway.

Personally, I\'m all for euthanasia, the right to die for the terminally ill who suffer. But I won\'t yet go into a definition as to how to classify these \"terminally ill who suffer\".

I\'ll keep it at this for now: right to die = good, duty to kill = bad. That\'s putting it extremely black and white, yes, and might seem in conflict with things I\'ve said earlier. But this isn\'t about Terri Schiavo. I have to admit that I\'m still struggling to fit that case into my beliefs.

[The_Punisher]

You\'re using the wrong words. Euthanasia is used to mean to kill off someone who doesn\'t have a say in the matter. I.E. Babies, Retarded people, comatose people.

I have no problem with a person committing suicide, a person signing a DNR order, or a person signing a Legal Document to allow them to pass away.

But until you have one of those... Or a mentally handicapped lady, a retarded person or a baby / fetus gives you consent to let them go, IT\'S MURDER.

[Sgt. Boomer]

@Ev- right, I should have said Op Ed

Hmmmmm. I’d say at the deepest moral level I’m against all forms of “mercy killing”, even assisted suicide. Whether I’ll be able to make a “reasoned” case for that I don’t know. Certainly not tonight- it’s late, I’m tired, and my brain hurts- but I’ll be back to give it a shot.

[[JR]]

Quote:eu?tha?na?sia (yth-nzh, -zh-)
n.

1. The act or practice of ending the life of an individual suffering from a terminal illness or an incurable condition, as by lethal injection or the suspension of extraordinary medical treatment.
2. A quiet, painless death.


Source: The American Heritage? Stedman\'s Medical Dictionary
Copyright ? 2002, 2001, 1995 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company.

Main Entry: eu?tha?na?sia
Pronunciation: \"y?-th&-\'nA-zh&
Function: noun
: the act or practice of killing or permitting the death of hopelessly sick or injured persons in a relatively painless way for reasons of mercy called also mercy killing —eu?tha?na?sic /-\'nA-zik, -sik/ adjective

The dictionary entry doesn\'t really help clear up the defenition on this, but I disagree with you there pun. Euthanasia is in some cases requested by the person in question, if they have a condition that merits it. Its not (just?) for people who have no say in the matter, as you say.

@ Looking forward to it Boomer

[=D.C.L.I=Everest]

=D.C.L.I=Everest Wrote:euthanasia, the right to die for the terminally ill who suffer.

[JR Wrote:]

Quote:eu?tha?na?sia (yth-nzh, -zh-)
n.

1. The act or practice of ending the life of an individual suffering from a terminal illness or an incurable condition, as by lethal injection or the suspension of extraordinary medical treatment.
2. A quiet, painless death.


Source: The American Heritage? Stedman\'s Medical Dictionary
Copyright ? 2002, 2001, 1995 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company.

Main Entry: eu?tha?na?sia
Pronunciation: "y?-th&-\'nA-zh&
Function: noun
: the act or practice of killing or permitting the death of hopelessly sick or injured persons in a relatively painless way for reasons of mercy called also mercy killing —eu?tha?na?sic /-\'nA-zik, -sik/ adjective

I got it right without even looking it up then? Coolness 8)

[[JR]]

Well you would hope that if you start a debate on a topic such as this, you at least know the defenition of the word

[Yellowbelly]

I think if a person wants it for themselves, then they can have it, otherwise no.

[dr.moe]

i think its a good idea, or rather, not a bad idea to have euthanasia. there should be some long process to get the \"treatment\" including a psychological assessment along with the consent of the guardians.

but as for letting doctors decide which babies are healthy enough to let live, rather than the parents deciding if raising a handicapped child would be worth their time, is wrong.

i think that if a person decides to end their life, and will not be swayed from their decision, than thats their choice and should be respected. as for doctors assisting them, that may not have to be mandatory - there could be clinics that specialise in euthanization. i know not all doctors agree with or perform abortions and there are abortion clinics all over the place to fill that niche.

i dont see any reason why euthanization need be any different.