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+-- Forum: TTR General Forums (/forumdisplay.php?fid=1)
+--- Forum: Ideas and Suggestions (/forumdisplay.php?fid=6)
+--- Thread: Adrenaline? (/showthread.php?tid=84)
RE: RE: RE: Adrenaline? - Jognt - 01-22-2005 03:22 AM
The_Punisher Wrote:No, adrenaline is one of those things you can\'t code in for the player. What you have to do is try to actually get their real adrenaline pumping.
Like sometimes, if I\'m in INF, and half my squad gets mowed down, I get really excited and jumpy. Especially if I take all those mofos out.
i agree with you too
if im playing TTR, and im surviving the *war* i get my own adrenaline pumping
and the last thing id like is for my ingame character to breath fast and be able to run incredibly far, if all i want to do is settle down to take that one shot.If your jumpy yourself, aiming good is harder already, so you are sort of your own effect
btw, *wooh my adrenline is pumping, lets run into the MG gunner* sounds like a deathwish to me, i would duck for more cover :/ or nade the sob
RE: Adrenaline? - Destiny@Work - 01-22-2005 06:18 AM
Hmm maybe it could be implented as a mod kind of thing, only if there is the time todo it naturally.
I would really like to atleast try out how this works out, often things you cant imagine to work well are doing just that when actually in use.
RE: Adrenaline? - isoFlux - 01-22-2005 09:15 AM
i agree with those who say no to adrenaline. this is one of those things that is best brought to the action by the player punisher got it right: when an MG is suppressing an area, or a hidden sniper is picking off my team mates, i get jumpy. not like an \"oh my fucking god, i am going to die in 3 seconds...\" jumpy that would be experienced by a real soldier, but its still there. i suggest trying to make TTR so realistic, immersive, and graphic, that the player himself/herself actually starts to feel it.
adrenaline is something VERY hard to recreate in-game with coding, and i think most anything we could come up with wouldnt be very realistic.
this is the same kind of thing as skill systems, in a way. \"men in combat longer get more exerience... etc\". yes, but the player also gets more adept at the game and so a player who has been playing for more hours controls an avatar in-game that has experienced more combat and so is more seasoned.
RE: Adrenaline? - The_Punisher - 01-22-2005 09:20 AM
There is nothing more awesome then when you get the lighting right, the mood right, and the Japs coming at you in swarms.
I get so freaked out whenever I play Pacific Assault on that one level. You can barely see anything, and then that flare goes over and you can see them. Damn.
RE: Adrenaline? - Sgt. Boomer - 02-16-2005 11:31 AM
Sounds like a morale system! I like the idea.
I remember seeing in a mag once that America’s Army was going to make it so that when you where being shot at it would be harder to aim (in IS view - like standing instead of crouching), so that covering fire would actually be of some use. Can’t say I’ve really noticed it though - maybe it wasn’t A’s A, or maybe I just get killed to quick to notice it. R6 did something like that too when team-mates were killed.
But ya, being shot at, explosions, getting hit, team-mates killed (and maybe the distance to the nearest friendly control point: farther = more adren), should all give you an adrenaline rush- with the effects being hands shake more (harder to aim/less accuracy), short burst of speed, blood pounding in your ears, vision blurred.
Plus there should be things that reduce adrenaline- firing your weapon, running (fight or flight), having other team-mates around, and being close to a friendly control point.
One thing it would do is make it MUCH more difficult for weaselly little spawn campers to get a hit.
Personally I like anything that adds to the challenge of getting a hit (recoil, IS, “sway” or “float”
rather than just point and click and wait for the computer to randomly decide when a bullet hits the target.I realize it might be hard/impossible to do in a game, but it’s a good idea nonetheless.
RE: Adrenaline? - The_Punisher - 02-16-2005 11:50 AM
You can\'t code in covering fire effects. You have to punish the player if he decides to jump out when people are using covering fire.
Sure, there\'s a distant chance that by jumping out and spraying like crazy the person might hit something. But more likely, he\'s going to get nailed and he\'s going to have to wait 40-60 seconds to be able to come back. His team mates are going to be down a man possibly when they might need him most.
RE: RE: Adrenaline? - Sgt. Boomer - 02-16-2005 01:34 PM
The_Punisher Wrote:You can\'t code in covering fire effects. You have to punish the player if he decides to jump out when people are using covering fire.Hmmmmmmmm. Well, you can program a game so that you can HEAR when a bullet comes close to you, so theoretically you should be able to trigger some other events from bullets passing/hitting nearby.
The_Punisher Wrote:Sure, there\'s a distant chance that by jumping out and spraying like crazy the person might hit something. But more likely, he\'s going to get nailed and he\'s going to have to wait 40-60 seconds to be able to come back. His team mates are going to be down a man possibly when they might need him most.Actually that’s kind of the point. Typically in games like DoD or A’sA, if you have two groups clashing, say of 5 guys each, about 8 of them will be killed in a 30-60 sec firefight. So the game becomes a case of hide-and-seek, kill quick, die, respawn, repeat. Generally you spend much more time finding the enemy than fighting them. Not to mention the times you get shot in the back waaaaay behind the “front line”.
Compare that to some of the longer more intense firefights in CoD. A couple of times playing DoD_Flash I saw some longer firefights and they were great fun. Personally, I’d rather have a good 3 or 4 minute firefight where the odds of hitting/being hit were a lot lower, but I spent more time shooting than playing hide-and-seek.
Does anyone else feel that way or am I alone on that?
RE: Adrenaline? - Reno - 02-16-2005 01:50 PM
This is a very hard subject to look into thouroughly, mainly due to the fact that its very hard to simulate what is going to go through a player\'s mind as they are under heavy suppressing fire.
This is far easier to maintain for AI because you control everything they do through script, and the AI really arent consiquenced in anyway by hindering them based on the situation, or making them act more like people in a heavy fire fight.
Setting this up for people is a much harder situation that could ever pop up when making AI, because different people do different things. One player may duck and wait out the fire fight, while another might jump up and lay their own suppresing fire so others could move to flank.
Its possible to implement a slight \"Morale System\" in that being under fire for too long, more than just suppresing fire would lower the Avatar in game\'s ability to function, forcing the player to make a choice: either lay my own fire, and suppress the opponets, or try to make a move. Either situation could potentially be bad for a player, as that they could get killed. So say a player decides to stay put. Eventually their ability to fight would degrade(a nulled \"shellshock\" if anything) and the further they wait, the more the painful decision pushes at them, there by simulating(probably better than i could program manually)combat stress.
Its just and idea, but instead of forcing a player to lose the ability to fight automatically as they are suppressed as opposed to making them make painful choices could be bad.
Then again, this could all be just random mumblings
RE: Adrenaline? - The_Punisher - 02-16-2005 02:23 PM
Like I\'ve said in the past, I\'m against coding in effects that you would feel if A, B, or C happen that are purely psychological.
But, if you put in bullet sounds, 3d directional sounds, terrain hit effects, shockwaves, the sight (and only sight) of your squad mates getting torn up you as the player should react to what\'s happening.
RE: Adrenaline? - Sgt. Boomer - 02-16-2005 07:40 PM
Reno - yah, I guess I‘ve crossed the line from “suggestion” to “idle musings”, but thanks for responding anyway.
I’ll agree with Punisher about no psychological effects- going berserk or cowering or whatever- but what I was trying to get at was the physical effects of adrenaline. I guess “morale system” was kind of misleading.
I was thinking about dynamic crosshairs that gets larger or smaller, or sniper scopes and iron sights that “sway” faster or slower. As it is, the targeting system (IS or Xhair) in most games changes based on stance, and sometimes other factors like wounds , movement, etc.
I’m afraid I don’t know anything about programming, it just seemed to me that if a bullet/explosion could cause the health statistic to be lowered, which in turn could make the targeting system harder, and stance could make it harder too, then perhaps you could do the same thing with an adrenaline statistic- as a physical response to danger causing physical reactions, like hands shaking- that would also make it harder to aim.
As I said, I like anything that adds to the challenge of getting a hit (recoil, IS, “sway”
rather than just point and click. It would certainly make it harder to hit the enemy once you came under fire. But if you just started squeezing off rounds in the enemy direction you could start to lower your adrenaline and raise their’s until finally you could get a good aimed shot. Obviously MG’s would become extremely important, and it would force players to use more realistic squad tactics: fire and maneuver and retreating rather than fighting to the last man, which is what usually ends up happening in DoD, etc. That would lower the overall body count in a game, which obviously some players wouldn’t like. But for me, I think it would feel more like WWII, rather than Quake in period costume, which is how some games feel. (*cough* BF’42 *cough*)
I guess it\'s a matter of taste.8)